The people have spoken. No gay marriage in California (and in a couple of other states). DISCUSS.

oh well ppl really care about this. NO GAYS!!!......they are still going to date and life together so baning marriage is kinda pointless but still why ppl felt the need to ban idk

[quote]they are still going to date and life together[/quote] Oh, I'm sure people are fine with that. They just don't want gay marriage. As for why, it's (OBVIOUSLY) a religious issue.

The bigots are retarded. End of discussion.

Eh, it'll just get thrown out as unconstitutional later.

^ Exactly. It's pretty much fucked once it gets to the Supreme Court.

They aren't bigots. They're religious, and their religion tells them that it's wrong. It's not like they've banned homosexual relations. Sure, it's not great, but I know that many of the people who voted for Prop 8 had absolutely nothing against homosexuality. But I guess people like to victimize themselves.

[quote]They aren't bigots. They're religious, and their religion tells them that it's wrong. It's not like they've banned homosexual relations. Sure, it's not great, but I know that many of the people who voted for Prop 8 had absolutely nothing against homosexuality. But I guess people like to victimize themselves.[/quote] I hate to break it to you, but religion can't [i]make[/i] anyone do anything. People are responsible for their own actions. If they choose to interpret their religion that way, they've got some problem with homosexuality.

[quote]I hate to break it to you, but religion can't [i]make[/i] anyone do anything. People are responsible for their own actions. If they choose to interpret their religion that way, they've got some problem with homosexuality.[/quote] I didn't say they weren't responsible or that religion physically made them. But it's their set of ideologies, and they are going to follow them. I hate to break it to you, but I think you're worse than they are because you are so quick to hate them and consider them bigots. They don't have a problem with homosexuality - they have one with gay marriage. I know a lot of people who voted yes, and none of them are homophobic in the least. Most of them just have a certain view on gay marriage because that is what all Christian churches are telling them. That is not the same thing as having "some problem with homosexuality". It's not the same thing at all.

[quote]I didn't say they weren't responsible or that religion physically made them. But it's their set of ideologies, and they are going to follow them. I hate to break it to you, but I think you're worse than they are because you are so quick to hate them and consider them bigots. They don't have a problem with homosexuality - they have one with gay marriage. I know a lot of people who voted yes, and none of them are homophobic in the least. Most of them just have a certain view on gay marriage because that is what all Christian churches are telling them. That is not the same thing as having "some problem with homosexuality". It's not the same thing at all.[/quote] You're trying to tell me they're responsible for their ideologies and yet also excusing them from them because of the churches at the same time. Which is it?

why was this even set into prop

^^Organized religion is just brainwashing anyway.

[quote]You're trying to tell me they're responsible for their ideologies and yet also excusing them from them because of the churches at the same time. Which is it?[/quote] Whichever makes you feel better.

Those protesters at them moment should just shut up and go home and wait when this, as Kiwi said, goes to the Supreme Court because chances are it will get overturned.

[quote]Whichever makes you feel better.[/quote] So... you don't even know. That's what I thought. Word of advice: don't argue with someone unless you're willing to put up a presentable case, all right?

[quote]So... you don't even know. That's what I thought. Word of advice: don't argue with someone unless you're willing to put up a presentable case, all right?[/quote]lol Can you even see the ground from your pedestal? How far do your feet dangle from the ground? You're trying to do the whole, "I'm going to twist your words around to fit MY argument" thing, which is why I replied the way I did. Because you're an asshole and I don't want to associate with you, let alone play the game of argument. I'm well aware of what I'm trying to say, but clearly none of that will get to you because you have a two-inch thick casing around your entire skull.

Somebody's [i]sensitive.[/i] I asked for clarification because what you said was completely contradictory and it didn't make any bloody sense. If you're not willing to clarify, you've forfeited your point. Now, if you really want to avoid associating with me that badly, stop posting and trying to defend your honor. If not, well, you're completely free to keep making a fool of yourself. I can't tell you what to do, after all...

[quote]Somebody's [i]sensitive.[/i] I asked for clarification because what you said was completely contradictory and it didn't make any bloody sense. If you're not willing to clarify, you've forfeited your point. Now, if you really want to avoid associating with me that badly, stop posting and trying to defend your honor. If not, well, you're completely free to keep making a fool of yourself. I can't tell you what to do, after all...[/quote] I thought Robber Baron's point was very clear and non-contradictory. It was you who decided to inject your own biased opinion regarding religious belief into the discussion, which muddied your understanding of what Robber Baron was trying to say. People don't always CHOOSE to be religious, they often don't know any other way to frame the world. Until their beliefs get seriously challenged, they have no reason to think there's anything wrong with them. THAT is the context within which Robber Baron was working. But the point is still valid - they're not trying to hurt homosexuals, they just want the definition of marriage to be maintained because it is a basic tenet of their religious traditions. That's not unreasonable, malicious, or hateful.

All right. I'm wrong...

[quote]I didn't say they weren't responsible or that religion physically made them. But it's their set of ideologies, and they are going to follow them. I hate to break it to you, but I think you're worse than they are because you are so quick to hate them and consider them bigots. They don't have a problem with homosexuality - they have one with gay marriage. I know a lot of people who voted yes, and none of them are homophobic in the least. Most of them just have a certain view on gay marriage because that is what all Christian churches are telling them. That is not the same thing as having "some problem with homosexuality". It's not the same thing at all.[/quote] Well spoken.